More Talks for David Kirby

16 Jun

According to his HuffPo blog David is giving some more talks. This time not in the uninterested UK but in the NE US.

David says:

I sincerely encourage any and all vaccine-autism skeptics, critics, agnostics and cynics living in the northeastern US to please consider attending one of these talks, armed with all of your most pointed, difficult and critical questions.

I have some questions which, had family circumstances allowed, I would’ve liked to have asked David when he was over here. What I hope is that NE US skeptics who might be attending, will ask some of the following questions.

1) Given your book is subtitled ‘mercury in vaccines and the autism epidemic’, do you feel it has now been scientifically established that mercury in vaccines does not cause autism? If not, what peer reviewed journal published science touching on mercury in vaccines do you believe supports your books subtitle?

2) You say that during the talk(s) you will discuss ‘The Poling Case – in which the government conceded that vaccines induced autism in one little girl…’. Could you read out the statement from the government where they provide this concession – that vaccines induced autism – and also tell us where we can read it for ourselves, including the location of the source document.

3) Do you agree with Professor Sander Greeland (PSC witness for the families in the continuing Omnibus Autism Procedings) that if vaccines did cause autism and were responsible for ‘an autism epidemic’ that would be detectable in the epidemiological literature? If so, how do you account for all peer reviewed journal published science not establishing an autism epidemic?

4) IN 2005, you said in a FAIR Autism Media interview: ‘It’s now 2005…..[W]e should see fewer cases entering the system [cdds] this year than we did last year.’ – was that the case? If not, does this explain why you then said in a reply to blogger Citizen Cain: ‘if the total number of 3-5 year olds in the California DDS system has not declined by 2007, that would deal a severe blow to the autism-thimerosal hypothesis…..total cases among 3-5 year olds, not changes in the rate of increase is the right measure.’. Do you consider a severe blow has been dealt to the autism-thiomersal hypothesis?

5) Do you consider yourself a fair and impartial journalist on this issue? If so, could you explain how Wendy Fournier of the National Autism Association built your website? Could you further explain to us where you feel the vaccines-autism hypothesis falls down?

6) You state in your literature that a ‘former NIH director’ has stated autism is an epidemic. Is this Bernadine Healy, former member of The Advancement of Sound Science Coalition who are lobbyists for Phillip Morris and Lorillard Tobacco (amongst others) and claim that second hand smoking is not dangerous? Do you feel comfortable with her stance on medical science issues?

What about you Dear Reader? What skeptical questions would you like to ask – or have someone ask – David?

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14 Responses to “More Talks for David Kirby”

  1. Ms. Clark June 16, 2008 at 09:32 #

    Mr. Kirby, on page 17 of your book, “Evidence of Harm,” you wrote the following: “ASD which includes the ‘classic’ full-blown autism, PDD,NOS, Rett syndrome, and Asperger syndrome (the so called Idiot Savant malady popularized in the film Rain Man), is a neurodevelopmental disorder that emerges early in life.”

    Do you still think that Asperger syndrome is the same as “idiot savantism”? If so do you think that you are qualified to comment on any form of autism? And why did you include Rett syndrome but not Childhood Disintegrative Disorder?

    Your book also says on page 48 that mercury is the “second most toxic substance on earth,” “after plutonium.” Where (on earth) did you get that? Did you ask any toxicologists if it was true? Did you consult any toxicologists in writing your book? Any experts at all outside of those tightly allied with the mercury parents?

  2. Caroline June 16, 2008 at 11:30 #

    Kev,
    Thanks so much for being one step ahead of the rest of us as usual. It’s a shame you can’t come to NYC and confront David Kirby yourself! I’m sure you’d rip him to shreds using valid stats and science as opposed to his pseudoscientific drivel.
    I would really like to go armed with the points you just raised (I live in the NE US) but NYC (the closest to me) is 2.5-3 hours away and I don’t know if I can fit in into my schedule. I’m hoping Kristina will- go she lives much closer. Hope someone videotapes the lecture- I would love to see him be confronted with your questions on youtube!

  3. Caroline June 16, 2008 at 13:44 #

    Mr. Kirby,
    Why do you continue to suggest that autism as a form of mitochnodrial disorder when the actual manifestations of the conditions are quite different from each other?

  4. Philip Morris June 16, 2008 at 14:00 #

    If second hand smoke is so dangerous, how come I never got high from going to rock concerts where lots of pot was being smoked?

  5. Joseph June 16, 2008 at 15:16 #

    I would ask him about his California confounds that supposedly explain why removal of thimerosal didn’t cause the autism 3-5 caseload trend to even flinch a little. They include crematoria, forest fires and mercury deposits from China. The questions are the following:

    1. What is the evidence that any of these “confounds” are associated with autism?

    2. What is the evidence that the increase trends of these confounds were such that they would’ve precisely offset thimerosal removal at the right time?

    3. What is the evidence that in states without these same confounds the incidence of autism has decreased?

  6. Kev June 16, 2008 at 15:33 #

    Phillip Morris of Londonderry, New Hampshire – back to your own blog with the rest of the lowlifes.

  7. Matt June 16, 2008 at 17:04 #

    Somehow, I figured “Phillip Morris” was an old “friend”. I got the coasts mixed up, though.

    I wouldn’t really have a question for Mr. Kirby. I would consider pointing out that the Mitochondrial angle isn’t really rising very high with the PSC lawyers. Contrary to the claims when the Poling information hit the scene, the Omnibus didn’t rely on the idea of mitochondrial dysfunction. It doesn’t even look like it was a planned strategy. Here is a discussion held between Kent Heckenlively (of AoA) and Tom Powers of the PSC in December of last year (after the concession, and after the PSC were already building the case for this May):

    “One issue which has come up recently is that one of the cases set for review is likely to be settled by the government. According to an e-mail posted on the web-site for the Autism Omnibus Proceeding by Mr. Powers, “Within the last week we learned that respondent is conceding one of the potential cases that vaccines caused the “significant aggravation” on an underlying condition.”

    When I questioned Mr. Powers about whether this was a possible break in the case, he replied that the particular case dealt with a claimant who had a diagnosed mitochondrial disorder. As a result, it probably won’t have much of an effect on the other cases”

    (Bold mine)

  8. kristina June 16, 2008 at 17:35 #

    All noted—-I am curious where he will talk in New Jersey, which is the original home of Safe Minds……

  9. ThoJ June 16, 2008 at 19:33 #

    Mr Kirby is an interesting gentleman.

    There is a vigorous discussion ongoing here and on other blogs–including his own. However, he doesn’t take part in the discussion, even in responses to his own blog posts.

    Should he wish for a discussion, he is cordially invited to take part.

  10. Matt June 17, 2008 at 00:21 #

    I am a bit of a loss as to why I would ask David Kirby questions. I guess he can answer the “why” and “how” he came to a conclusion.

    But, as to his conclusions themselves, I’ll either look at the data and papers myself, or ask the experts in the fields he discusses.

    These things I have done. I wish Mr. Kirby well in his talks. I note that he has a major flaw in his description of one of his topics, one he is well aware of.

    I also note that he appears to be much more polite than some of the people who have been discussing his upcoming talks. For that, I thank Mr. Kirby.

  11. Ringside seat June 17, 2008 at 09:13 #

    In years to come, he will declare: “Oh, I never said that vaccines cause autism. All I said was that there was a need for a debate and more research.”

  12. Albert June 17, 2008 at 15:36 #

    Shame on Kirby for exploiting Tim Russert’s death to publicize his own views about autism, and shame on Kirby for using the Huffington Post to publicize his speaking engagements (all organized by his friends).

  13. Matt June 19, 2008 at 06:50 #

    I also note that he appears to be much more polite than some of the people who have been discussing his upcoming talks. For that, I thank Mr. Kirby.

    I’ll note that the above comment was in reference to Mr. Kirby’s supporters–such as many responding to his blog post/announcement.

    They have not been always polite about this, using the idea that people are invited to come and pose questions as some sort of hammer to bash others.

    For those who see Mr. Kirby as a primary source of information–if you are happy with your choice, go with that. Many of us like to check up on Mr Kirby’s interpretations of facts, and the facts themselves. He has often been found lacking.

  14. Phil June 21, 2008 at 00:33 #

    Great questions, Kev, as usual. It would be funny – all this ducking and weaving from the facts. But they’ve been doing it for so long now I’d actually be calling it sad, not funny.

    And I’m tempted to ask “Phillip Morris” something but I won’t bite!

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