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	<title>Comments on: David Kirby: No friend to my autistic kid</title>
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	<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/</link>
	<description>Autism news and opinion</description>
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		<title>By: Stan</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-69570</link>
		<dc:creator>Stan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Nov 2009 16:57:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-69570</guid>
		<description>Joseph:
Thks for your openness to look at critiques of some of the studies cited by the Powers That Be to exonerate vaccines from the autism debacle.  I have been going though my files (read, more  accurately:piles) of material to look for one, as an example, that I had downloaded, from Dr. F.E. Yazbak on the &#039;Denmark&#039; study.  I couldn&#039;t find it right now, but in googling &#039;Yazbak autism Denmark study analysis&#039; or some such, I came across a reference to that critique - by him  and Dr Gary Goldman - at:whaleto.a/mmry   Also: autismimmunityproject.org/yazbak.doc
In critiquing the original, &#039;Masden&#039; study (there was a question of the cohorts he used) they concluded that in point of fact &quot;there has been a serious increase in autism in children under 14 in Denmark in the last few years&quot; [this was published in &#039;04) &quot;in connection with the introduction of the MMR in 1987...The present rise in autism in Denmark has clearly started 4 to 5 years after the introduction of the MMR vaccine and [furthermore] it appears to correspond with the  percentage of children who received the MMR.&quot;

Dr Yazbak also figured in the critique of the Eric Fombonne study  out of Canada, with its moving of the goal  posts as well (from one town to another): prnewswire.com/news-releases/newly-released-canadian-study-links-vaccine-with-[PDD].

Also a good  source: fourteenstudies.org

Joseph and Sullivan: Re increase:
(1) A recent study  out of California found it was not just due to better or wider diagnosing:
ucdmc.ucdavis.edu/news 
This study seems to date to 2002; I think there has been a more recent one out of the M.I.N.D. Institute of U of Cal at Davis, but I haven&#039;t been able to source it right now.

As for reports of school districts being stretched terribly for special needs ed, Anne Dachel has researched this matter quite a bit.  Her email address: adachel06@yahoo.com.

Good luck - and thanks to both of you for your interest in this matter.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joseph:<br />
Thks for your openness to look at critiques of some of the studies cited by the Powers That Be to exonerate vaccines from the autism debacle.  I have been going though my files (read, more  accurately:piles) of material to look for one, as an example, that I had downloaded, from Dr. F.E. Yazbak on the &#8216;Denmark&#8217; study.  I couldn&#8217;t find it right now, but in googling &#8216;Yazbak autism Denmark study analysis&#8217; or some such, I came across a reference to that critique &#8211; by him  and Dr Gary Goldman &#8211; at:whaleto.a/mmry   Also: autismimmunityproject.org/yazbak.doc<br />
In critiquing the original, &#8216;Masden&#8217; study (there was a question of the cohorts he used) they concluded that in point of fact &#8220;there has been a serious increase in autism in children under 14 in Denmark in the last few years&#8221; [this was published in &#8216;04) &#8220;in connection with the introduction of the <span class="caps">MMR</span> in 1987&#8230;The present rise in autism in Denmark has clearly started 4 to 5 years after the introduction of the <span class="caps">MMR</span> vaccine and [furthermore] it appears to correspond with the  percentage of children who received the <span class="caps">MMR</span>.&#8221;</p>
<p>Dr Yazbak also figured in the critique of the Eric Fombonne study  out of Canada, with its moving of the goal  posts as well (from one town to another): prnewswire.com/news-releases/newly-released-canadian-study-links-vaccine-with-[PDD].</p>
<p>Also a good  source: fourteenstudies.org</p>
<p>Joseph and Sullivan: Re increase:<br />
(1) A recent study  out of California found it was not just due to better or wider diagnosing:<br />
ucdmc.ucdavis.edu/news<br />
This study seems to date to 2002; I think there has been a more recent one out of the M.I.N.D. Institute of U of Cal at Davis, but I haven&#8217;t been able to source it right now.</p>
<p>As for reports of school districts being stretched terribly for special needs ed, Anne Dachel has researched this matter quite a bit.  Her email address: <a href="mailto:adachel06@yahoo.com">adachel06@yahoo.com</a>.</p>
<p>Good luck &#8211; and thanks to both of you for your interest in this matter.</p>
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		<title>By: Dedj</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-69456</link>
		<dc:creator>Dedj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Nov 2009 22:18:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-69456</guid>
		<description>Indeed, even in my own education back in the 80&#039;s , disabled children were not seen at school at all. My first contact with a disabled pupil was not until I moved across town to the new technology college, which had one visibly disabled pupil out of 800 pupils, well below what could be expected on random chance alone.

Subsequent meet-ups, reunions, newspaper articles and facebook profiles indicate that the a sizeable number of the people I went to school with have since recieved significant diagnosis, even though the traits they were diagnosed for were in existance at school. In some cases these traits would often result in detention. Very few were in the Special Ed class like they would be now.

Even now, I&#039;ve came across professionals who absolutely refuse to have their officially diagnosed children statemented, even though they know it&#039;s probably the best way for their child.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Indeed, even in my own education back in the 80&#8217;s , disabled children were not seen at school at all. My first contact with a disabled pupil was not until I moved across town to the new technology college, which had one visibly disabled pupil out of 800 pupils, well below what could be expected on random chance alone.</p>
<p>Subsequent meet-ups, reunions, newspaper articles and facebook profiles indicate that the a sizeable number of the people I went to school with have since recieved significant diagnosis, even though the traits they were diagnosed for were in existance at school. In some cases these traits would often result in detention. Very few were in the Special Ed class like they would be now.</p>
<p>Even now, I&#8217;ve came across professionals who absolutely refuse to have their officially diagnosed children statemented, even though they know it&#8217;s probably the best way for their child.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-69454</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Nov 2009 21:32:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-69454</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;But in following this issue for some years now, I have been struck with the ‘anecdotal evidence’ from many long-time teachers around the country that they never saw the number of ‘developmentally disabled’ kids coming through years ago that they have been seeing these days. And I know when I was in high school, in the early 50s, there was nowhere’s near the incidence of such kids as there are these days – an incidence that is breaking many school systems’ budgets, and making it difficult to find sufficient teachers trained to deal with the ‘developmentally challenged’ now coming through.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

@Stan: Do you have a reference supporting this claim that special education is breaking school systems&#039; budgets?

Even if it&#039;s true for some school here or there, if this were a widespread issue, then we&#039;d be able to clearly see that in IDEA statistics, for example, wouldn&#039;t we?

What we see instead is that the total population of students in special education has been roughly stable, relative to population growth.

The &quot;anecdotal&quot; evidence you claim exists (is it documented anywhere?) does not tell us much either. Teachers would have to recall back one generation and try to diagnose or rediagnose children from memory. Would they even be qualified to do that if they had perfect recollection?

&lt;blockquote&gt;And contrary to reports, the studies ruling out the vaccine line are not all that strong; and some have been so obviously ‘methodologically flawed’ as to make it appear that it was on purpose. Not helpful in scientific terms either.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

In my experience, anti-vax critiques of papers are typically just laundry lists of (known) limitations that don&#039;t explain away the results. 

For a paper critique to be worthwhile, in my view, it should point out something the authors overlooked that could completely change the interpretation of the results.

You&#039;re welcome to provide examples, though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>
<blockquote>But in following this issue for some years now, I have been struck with the &#8216;anecdotal evidence&#8217; from many long-time teachers around the country that they never saw the number of &#8216;developmentally disabled&#8217; kids coming through years ago that they have been seeing these days. And I know when I was in high school, in the early 50s, there was nowhere&#8217;s near the incidence of such kids as there are these days &#8211; an incidence that is breaking many school systems&#8217; budgets, and making it difficult to find sufficient teachers trained to deal with the &#8216;developmentally challenged&#8217; now coming through.</p></blockquote>
<p>@Stan: Do you have a reference supporting this claim that special education is breaking school systems&#8217; budgets?</p>
<p>Even if it&#8217;s true for some school here or there, if this were a widespread issue, then we&#8217;d be able to clearly see that in <span class="caps">IDEA</span> statistics, for example, wouldn&#8217;t we?</p>
<p>What we see instead is that the total population of students in special education has been roughly stable, relative to population growth.</p>
<p>The &#8220;anecdotal&#8221; evidence you claim exists (is it documented anywhere?) does not tell us much either. Teachers would have to recall back one generation and try to diagnose or rediagnose children from memory. Would they even be qualified to do that if they had perfect recollection?</p>
<p>
<blockquote>And contrary to reports, the studies ruling out the vaccine line are not all that strong; and some have been so obviously &#8216;methodologically flawed&#8217; as to make it appear that it was on purpose. Not helpful in scientific terms either.</p></blockquote>
<p>In my experience, anti-vax critiques of papers are typically just laundry lists of (known) limitations that don&#8217;t explain away the results.</p>
<p>For a paper critique to be worthwhile, in my view, it should point out something the authors overlooked that could completely change the interpretation of the results.</p>
<p>You&#8217;re welcome to provide examples, though.</p>
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		<title>By: Sullivan</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-69452</link>
		<dc:creator>Sullivan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Nov 2009 21:18:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-69452</guid>
		<description>Stan,

&lt;blockquote&gt;and I know when I was in high school, in the early 50s, there was nowhere’s near the incidence of such kids as there are these days&lt;/blockquote&gt;


Do you realize that in the 1950&#039;s, there was no mandate that the schools had to accept and teach disabled children?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stan,</p>
<p>
<blockquote>and I know when I was in high school, in the early 50s, there was nowhere&#8217;s near the incidence of such kids as there are these days</p></blockquote>
<p>Do you realize that in the 1950&#8217;s, there was no mandate that the schools had to accept and teach disabled children?</p>
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		<title>By: Stan</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-69451</link>
		<dc:creator>Stan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Nov 2009 21:03:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-69451</guid>
		<description>Sorry that I&#039;ve come across this thread so late in the &#039;day&#039;.  I would have liked to have been part of a dialogue on this issue.  But better late than never.

If we just stay with the main issue - about the incidence of ASD rising or not in the last 20 years or so - I feel that the clear potential answer was, indeed, clouded by a change in the criteria; extending it to include a larger range of PDDs.  Not helpful in scientific terms.  But in following this issue for some years now, I have been struck with the &#039;anecdotal evidence&#039; from many long-time teachers around the country that they never saw the number of &#039;developmentally disabled&#039; kids coming through years ago that they have been seeing these days.   And I know when I was in high school, in the early 50s, there was nowhere&#039;s near the incidence of such kids as there are these days - an incidence that is breaking many school systems&#039; budgets, and making it difficult to find sufficient teachers trained to deal with the &#039;developmentally challenged&#039; now coming through.  

So something has happened.  The question is what.  What has changed?

Any manner of things have changed.  But in terms of brain damage, there are few likely culprits.  And since brain damage HAS been sourced back to vaccines in the early days (50s-60s-70s), there is every good reason to believe that the increase in the vaccine schedule in the late 80s/early 90s - and the change in ingredients in the vaccines - is a major suspect in a true increase of ASD, not just due to a change in the official profile. 

Yes, pesticides can be involved.  Yes, mercury in the environment other than in vaccines can be involved.  Yes, EMFs can be involved.  Even pre-natal ultrasounds can be involved.  (All of these factors have increased over the years.)  But it is not far-fetched to suspect the role of vaccines in this tragedy - in this tragedy for the adults affected and children alike.  So the whole range of causal possibilities needs to be addressed.  And contrary to reports, the studies ruling out the vaccine line are not all that strong; and some have been so obviously &#039;methodologically flawed&#039; as to make it appear that it was on purpose.  Not helpful in scientific terms either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry that I&#8217;ve come across this thread so late in the &#8216;day&#8217;.  I would have liked to have been part of a dialogue on this issue.  But better late than never.</p>
<p>If we just stay with the main issue &#8211; about the incidence of <span class="caps">ASD</span> rising or not in the last 20 years or so &#8211; I feel that the clear potential answer was, indeed, clouded by a change in the criteria; extending it to include a larger range of PDDs.  Not helpful in scientific terms.  But in following this issue for some years now, I have been struck with the &#8216;anecdotal evidence&#8217; from many long-time teachers around the country that they never saw the number of &#8216;developmentally disabled&#8217; kids coming through years ago that they have been seeing these days.   And I know when I was in high school, in the early 50s, there was nowhere&#8217;s near the incidence of such kids as there are these days &#8211; an incidence that is breaking many school systems&#8217; budgets, and making it difficult to find sufficient teachers trained to deal with the &#8216;developmentally challenged&#8217; now coming through.</p>
<p>So something has happened.  The question is what.  What has changed?</p>
<p>Any manner of things have changed.  But in terms of brain damage, there are few likely culprits.  And since brain damage <span class="caps">HAS</span> been sourced back to vaccines in the early days (50s-60s-70s), there is every good reason to believe that the increase in the vaccine schedule in the late 80s/early 90s &#8211; and the change in ingredients in the vaccines &#8211; is a major suspect in a true increase of <span class="caps">ASD</span>, not just due to a change in the official profile.</p>
<p>Yes, pesticides can be involved.  Yes, mercury in the environment other than in vaccines can be involved.  Yes, EMFs can be involved.  Even pre-natal ultrasounds can be involved.  (All of these factors have increased over the years.)  But it is not far-fetched to suspect the role of vaccines in this tragedy &#8211; in this tragedy for the adults affected and children alike.  So the whole range of causal possibilities needs to be addressed.  And contrary to reports, the studies ruling out the vaccine line are not all that strong; and some have been so obviously &#8216;methodologically flawed&#8217; as to make it appear that it was on purpose.  Not helpful in scientific terms either.</p>
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		<title>By: David N. Brown</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-68212</link>
		<dc:creator>David N. Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 06:34:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-68212</guid>
		<description>A couple more things I was thinking about:  One is how rarely people in an animal&#039;s territory (esp. predators like big cats and wolves) actually see the animal.  The other is my personal experience with not being noticed.  For reasons I don&#039;t understand, I seem to be able to walk right up to someone and take him/her completely by surprise.  I do this now without even trying, but I wonder if it&#039;s a &quot;skill&quot; carried over from elementary school, when I believed that the only way to avoid abuse was to do absolutely nothing to attract attention.  How many adults might be doing this?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A couple more things I was thinking about:  One is how rarely people in an animal&#8217;s territory (esp. predators like big cats and wolves) actually see the animal.  The other is my personal experience with not being noticed.  For reasons I don&#8217;t understand, I seem to be able to walk right up to someone and take him/her completely by surprise.  I do this now without even trying, but I wonder if it&#8217;s a &#8220;skill&#8221; carried over from elementary school, when I believed that the only way to avoid abuse was to do absolutely nothing to attract attention.  How many adults might be doing this?</p>
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		<title>By: daedalus2u</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-68186</link>
		<dc:creator>daedalus2u</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 21:40:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-68186</guid>
		<description>People with autism who are now adults have had a lifetime to try and make themselves invisible.  Some of them have succeeded all too well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>People with autism who are now adults have had a lifetime to try and make themselves invisible.  Some of them have succeeded all too well.</p>
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		<title>By: Emily</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-68168</link>
		<dc:creator>Emily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:08:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-68168</guid>
		<description>Patrick, sadly my experiences predated the existence of &quot;gifted&quot; classes. We didn&#039;t have the G&amp;T option in those days. But you&#039;re correct...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Patrick, sadly my experiences predated the existence of &#8220;gifted&#8221; classes. We didn&#8217;t have the G&#038;T option in those days. But you&#8217;re correct&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Ringside Seat</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-68167</link>
		<dc:creator>Ringside Seat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:04:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-68167</guid>
		<description>I find it incredible (nah, that&#039;s just rhetoric) that David Kirby doesn&#039;t know what Asperger&#039;s syndrome/disorder is.  I mean, man, what a clown.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find it incredible (nah, that&#8217;s just rhetoric) that David Kirby doesn&#8217;t know what Asperger&#8217;s syndrome/disorder is.  I mean, man, what a clown.</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick</title>
		<link>http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2009/10/david-kirby-no-friend-to-my-autistic-kid/#comment-68166</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 17:59:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?p=3312#comment-68166</guid>
		<description>In addition to what Emily wrote, some ASD kids were also sent to the gifted classes, where they (and perhaps more in the class) were subjected to similar treatment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In addition to what Emily wrote, some <span class="caps">ASD</span> kids were also sent to the gifted classes, where they (and perhaps more in the class) were subjected to similar treatment.</p>
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