JB Handley, golden boy of Generation Rescue recently spoke to another newspaper. I thought the reporter did a very good job of showing both sides of the issue (Kirby, Olmsted take note).
I did however, have to read the article a few times until it sunk in. These were the passages that confused me.
Jamie’s moods progress fluidly from joy to concentration to panic. He has full run of his parents’ sprawling home, a hypoallergenic realm with wool carpets, insulation made from blue jeans and HEPA filters to clean the air.
One afternoon this summer, Jamie dragged his father by the finger to a mattress in the middle of the basement floor and, holding onto both of his hands, began jumping up and down, lofting higher and higher with each leap. The game was an autistic obsession. The blond boy sprang up again and again, never tiring, his face frozen in an expression of total joy.
Jamie eventually moved from the mattress to his train set, another obsession, and later to the table, where he covered reams of paper with spiraling circles, using his teeth to uncap each pen in the box until all the lids and pens lay on the floor where he cast them aside. All the while, he didn’t speak a word.
Three months later, Jamie had learned to point at things he wanted and to wave goodbye. He still screamed shrilly, ran back and forth, and didn’t speak in front of a reporter. His parents have augmented the biomedical regimen with other treatments—speech and occupational therapy and applied behavioral analysis, an intensive program that teaches autistic children to mimic “normal” behaviors, like waving goodbye.
So what am I confused about? Well, Jamie sounds exactly like my child. She does all the things Jamie is listed as doing above. In fact, in terms of her progress, she sounds ‘further along’ than Jamie. She has a few words now and the beginnings of a sentence or two although of course, like Jamie she has setbacks and meltdowns.
In fact the only appreciable difference between them as far as I can tell is that JB and Lisa chelate Jamie and we don’t chelate our daughter.
As I say, I’m totally confused. I thought chelation was supposed to ‘cure’ or ‘reverse’ autism? I was expecting to read about a Son-Rise style reversal where Jamie is verbal, engages constantly with the reporter etc. What I’m reading here is the normal progression of an autistic child. Now, granted I don’t know the exact program that Jamie is on but I know he must’ve been on it for a few months now. I’m also aware that he’s on TD DMPS. Read into that what you will.
I don’t mind admitting I’m a bit shocked by this. I was curious as to what a ‘recovered’ autistic child would be like and now it seems I have my answer – they’re just like an autistic child but without the sometimes painful comorbidities. If the Handley’s have removed those painful comorbidities then they’re to be congratulated. I am, however, at a loss to explain their statement that:
evidence that their cure is working can be seen in Jamie’s behavior
Cure for what? Mercury poisoning? Possibly. Autism? I really don’t think so. I didn’t before but I’m even less convinced after reading this.
Left Brain Right Brain 
Since I am low on time and patience, can someone tell me if HN is serious? I will say it again. HN, you are very confused. No, really, you are.
-Sue
Very serious. I also see you have posted any real data. I also believe that SafeMinds, NVIC and the Geiers are directly responsible for these babies:
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5128a2.htm
and
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5403a3.htm
and
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5403a4.htm
I kept a close eye on the pertussis situation because my oldest child has NEVER been vaccinated against pertussis. He had seizures and was those were contraindicated for DPT, so he had Dt instead. This was at a time when our county was having a pertussis epidemic. I followed the progress of the very slow approval process of the DTaP (which my youngest child got just after it finally became available).
Make that say: I see you have posted NO real data.
Sue, do you have a point? Other than not knowing much about the history of the pertussis vaccine, the inclusion of thimerosal and claiming the Geiers have anything to do with it?
Just answer this simple question:
Which vaccine in the PRESENT pediatric schedule is more dangerous than the actual disease? Be sure to include verifiable evidence (though due to their mishandling of data, do not include anything by the Geiers… also, do not include anything from the journal “Medical Hypothesis” — just look up the word “hypothesis” at http://www.dictionary.com for the reason).
I say present because the DTaP has replaced the DTP and that the IPV has replaced the OPV. If you need help figuring out what the actual vaccines are, the diseases and the risks associated with both you can check this out:
http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/pink/def_pink_full.htm
HN-
Let me just explain why I think that you are confused. As you go through my posts here and on the “mercury militia” post I don’t think that you will see that that I said the DTaP still contains thimerosal. I also already knew that the DTaP had replaced the DTP. I believe that you got confused in the sense that you took my quote from Kev’s blog post of August of 2004 and thought that they were my words. Re-check that and tell me if that is correct. I know it’s a silly little thing but you’ve mentioned it a few times…
Next, it seems as if you followed the DTP/DTaP far more closely than I did due to your oldest child. If I may, however, let me suggest that you read “The True Story of Pertussis Vaccination: A Sordid Legacy?” by the Geiers. You can google it to read. It seems that you don’t trust them but for kicks check it out. Here are a few excerpts from the article that pertain to what you and I have been going back and forth on:
1) “We (Geiers) were part of the transformation, supporting the advocates for the new, acellular vaccine with scientific testimony. Although our appearance in this story takes place in the 1980’s, the history of the vaccine began much earlier in th e twentieth century”.
2) “When Geier appeared before another IOM committee in 1990 and presented the data from the 1985 report, members asked where the data were from. They were surprised to learn that the data came from their own archives. After extensive hearings, this 1990 IOM committee concluded that the evidence was sufficient for them to state that whole-cell pertussis vaccine caused acute encephalopathy”.
— I know that you don’t trust the Geier’s but I imagine that you agree that even if Geier was only a pencil sharpener at the IOM committee meeting in 1990, he was there. I can’t imagine that he would make that up (too easy to be refuted). So, there is my evidence that he was doing something before 1992. You asked for me to present this info in a previous post. My point was, and still is, that he was correct then, and he’s correct now when he speaks of thimerosal being a huge medical nightmare.
– Sue
One more thing… It is quite unbecoming of you to suggest that SafeMinds, NVIC and the Geiers are directly responsible for the deaths of those three babies that you linked to. Any death to a child is tragic. Remember, First due no Harm. Why don’t you try comparing the deaths of those three babies who died from Pertussis with the deaths of the babies who died or were severely neurologically damaged by the unsafe DTP vaccine. I’m quite sure that the parents of all those children grieve just the same.
-Sue
I am very confident that Safeminds and others are responsible for the last ten years of the declining uptake of DTaP, and then for the deaths of those children. It may be unbecoming to you… but so are those declaring that the Geier’s have anything to do with the switch in 1997 of the DTP to DTaP. (The Geiers did some “unbecoming” things with the VAERS data, which is why they are no longer allowed access to the database).
The Geiers had nothing to do with the recommendations in 1992. You just saying so is NOT evidence. The fact that they say so in a book is NOT evidence. The Geiers are in it for the money they make through MedCon. Only one is a medical doctor (fertilility and reproduction).
Here is their earliest citation of vaccines in 2000, it is a lettter:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=11138356&query_hl=2
and one of their papers a year later:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=11791647&query_hl=2
Here is the next previous citation of one of them in the index, again a comment letter:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=8446014&query_hl=2 … the next earliest cites are also letters.
Let me repeat: There is absolutely NO evidence that either Geier was anywhere near the Immunization Practices Advisory Committee. Quoting a book written with a specific agenda (and knowing how they misuse VAERS data, I would not be surprised if they just made it up) is not enough.
Hey, I found a 1978 Vaccine article by Mark Geier… it has to do with finding too much bacterial contamination:
http://www.pubmedcentral.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&pubmedid=727776 (by the way, thimerosal is used to control bacteria growth in vaccines… though it was not used in ALL, like the MMR and polio, since it interfered with their effectiveness).
and
http://www.pubmedcentral.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&pubmedid=170250
and then nothing for several years. It is like he switched from bacteriology, to genetics with a letter in 1990 titled “Too much or too little science in sex selection techniques?”
I also found the pertussis “sordid history” paper (not a book) listed in PubMed. It is published in Journal of Medical History and Allied Sciences. I found one review praising the paper and the work of Mark Geier: a law firm. Oh, yeah… it just warms the cockles of my hear. Even funnier it ended with “Keep watching this web site for information on how Dr. Geier is developing a revolutionary method for treating mercury poisoned children. ” Oh, good grief. It is like a whole bandwagon of trumpeting cow piles!
HN-
We aren’t getting anywhere. I am pretty much done. Before I end this, however, I have a few comments/questions.
1) Children died from Pertussis and they died from the unsafe vaccine used to prevent it. End of story.
2) Can you point out where I said that I was quoting from a BOOK? No, I may have used article. This is about the 3rd or 4th time that you have accused me of something that I haven’t said or did. It makes you look foolish. Get it straight.
3) I know exactly where the “sordid history” paper is located because I actually read it. Why don’t you- Google it. You may actually learn something from it. It may actually help you in your argument. After reading it, you can go through and comment on the specific proof that you have that the Geiers have lied or overstated their involvement in the DTP/DTaP saga.
4) You said in a previous post, “If you have evidence that the Geier’s were in the trenches working on the change before 1992, please present it. Because the earliest I have from them is this letter of comment from 2000…”
— So, I presented it to you and now you don’t like it because it proves you very wrong. I’m sorry about that, but don’t get all defensive with me… just do your homework better next time.
Just remember HN…
“It’s (referring to Thimerosal in vaccines) the worst mistake that’s been made in the history of medicine.”
— Mark Geier
-Sue
As of yet you have provided no evidence. Perhaps you need a short course in how to quote weblinks: Go to the Address window, select the text with the webpage address, to a CTRL-C, then click on the target where you are writing a response and click on CTRL-V.
Now the place I have been doing much of my research is the index of medical journals from around the world (it even includes some fringe journals like “Homeopathy” and “Medical Hyposthesis”): http://www.pubmed.gov
It has a fairly easy search window to use, and sometimes the articles it indexes are available free online. Otherwise, you can go to your local university library (or some municipal libraries have the service) to get a full copy of the paper for free or a very nominal fee (not the typical $25 charged for online copy).
That is where I found this:
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00041836.htm which lists in the references the following paper:
CDC. Diphtheria, tetanus, and pertussis: recommendations for vaccine use and other preventive measures — recommendations of the Immunization Practices Advisory Committee (ACIP). MMWR 1991;40(No. RR-10).
CDC. Pertussis vaccination: acellular pertussis vaccine for reinforcing and booster use — supplementary Immunization Practices Advisory Committee (ACIP) statement. MMWR 1992:41(No. RR-1).
Mortimer EA, Jones PK. An evaluation of pertussis vaccine. Rev Infect Dis 1979;1:927-32.
Aoyama T, Murase Y, Kato M, Iwai H, Iwata T. Efficacy and immunogenicity of acellular pertussis vaccine by manufacturer and patient age. Am J Dis Child 1989;143:655-9.
Noble GR, Bernier RH, Esber EC, et al. Acellular and whole-cell pertussis vaccines in Japan; report of a visit by US scientists. JAMA 1987;257:1351-6.
Kimura M, Kuno-Sakai H. Developments in pertussis immunisation in Japan. Lancet 1990;336:30-2.
Mortimer EA, Kimura M, Cherry JD, et al. Protective efficacy of the Takeda acellular pertussis vaccine combined with diphtheria and tetanus toxoids following household exposure of Japanese children. Am J Dis Child 1990;144:899-904.
Ad hoc group for the study of pertussis vaccines. Placebo-controlled trial of two acellular pertussis vaccines in Sweden — Protective efficacy and adverse events. Lancet 1988;i:955-60.
Olin P. New conclusions and lessons learned from the vaccine trial in Sweden. In: Manclark CR, ed. Proceedings of the Sixth International Symposium on Pertussis. Bethesda, Maryland: Department of Health and Human Services, 1990; DHHS publication no. (FDA)90-1164, pp. 299-301.
CDC. Immunization Practices Advisory Committee. General recommendations on immunization. MMWR 1989;38:205-14,219-27.
Blennow M, Granstrom M. Adverse reactions and serologic responses to a booster dose of acellular pertussis vaccine in children immunized with acellular or whole-cell vaccine as infants. Pediatrics 1989;84:62-7.
Blumberg DA, Mink CM, Cherry JD, et al. Comparison of acellular and whole-cell pertussis-component diphtheria-tetanus-pertussis vaccines in infants. J Pediatr 1991;119:194-204.
….. which lists lots of people in lots of countries, and not one is named “Geier”.
Other useful places to research disease and their control is at http://www.cdc.gov and http://www.who.int. This article from WHO pretty much disagrees with Geier (but their purpose is the health of people in far flung places without electricity for refridgeration or clean running water — not trying help attorneys with lawsuits):
Click to access thiomersal.pdf
Now using your new research skills, please answer this question: Which vaccine in the present pediatric schedule is more dangerous than the disease?
Please include all references, preferably as weblinks.
(oh, by the way, any child under the age of four would have only had the DTaP withOUT thimerosal)
HN-
You are not worth my time. Actually, you just wasted a bunch of your time giving me references on information that I have no interest in. Really, what a waste. I have pointed out your errors in previous posts, it seems that once again you are defensive about it. So sorry.
I’m not about to engage you in what disease is more dangerous than the vaccine, etc. It is irrelevant to my main issue which is the tragedy of thimerosal in vaccines. I am fully aware that most vaccines are thimerosal-free now. Hopefully you know enough to look very closely at any booster shots that your kids get (they can contain thimerosal) and remember no flu shots.
One more point for you to ponder. This can be done without giving me a laundry list of stuff that I won’t look at anyway (trying to save you some time). You have said in a previous post that you kept a close eye on the pertussis situation because your oldest child was never vaccinated against it due to a medical condition (seizures). You also stated that your younger child got the “safer” DTaP version. Let’s look at the irony of that situation. Here you are giving me links to babies who died from pertussis and then you blame it on organizations such as SafeMinds, NVIC and the Geiers. Certainly, you must admit that the reason why you did not get the DTP for your son and the reason that you were able to get the “safer” DTaP is because of organizations such as these. I believe that Barbara Fisher (Co-Founder of NVIC) was one of the people who pushed for the safer version of the DTP. I wonder if your tune would be different on this topic if one of your children was neurologically injured (or died) from the DTP. Sadly, it took parents to push this change through. Our medical establishment knew about this issue in the 1950’s and did nothing. Does this remind you of anything… Can you say thimerosal??
Don’t forget…
“It’s (referring to Thimerosal in vaccines) the worst mistake that’s been made in the history of medicine”.
– Mark Geier
-Sue
You have not given me any evidence that has any veracity. The plain fact is that with the scaremongering done by Safeminds, NVIC and their ilk that there are people even echewing the safer DTaP withOUT thimerosal… and then the babies die. Barbara Loe Fisher at one time was very important in the change from DTP to DTaP… but that function has lapsed, her NVIC website does not update when the facts do not concur with her general anti-vax agenda (she has become close-minded to improvements, and now provides a soap-box to quacks selling supposed cures).
You’ve not pointed out any errors except with references to a genetist doctor and his son who make money by trying to help lawyers win money against vaccine manufacturers. You’ve not posted any real evidence at all.
You say you do not care to look at the loads of references I gave you. Why is that? Does it show that you are close minded and do not care to see data that contradicts your point of view? Are you so sure that what you know is so “true”? http://www.pathguy.com/antiimmu.htm
Why should I fear a booster shot? Or an influenza shot for my kid with the genetic heart condition? The amount of thimerosal in one of those is a mere fraction of what is in a tuna sandwich! How would that impact him more than a severe case of flu with his hypertrophic cardiomyopathy with obstruction (the reason he has to take antibiotics before getting his teeth cleaned at the dentist)?
As to the quote from Geier… think about the World Health Organization link I included (READ it!, stop being so close minded).
Again: Which vaccine in the present pediatric schedule is more dangerous than the actual disease? Include all references.
HN-
Oh boy, here we go again…
1) You should be kissing Barbara Loe Fischer’s butt instead of calling her a baby killer.
2) I pointed out 4 errors that you made. Ok, 3 of the 4 are silly little things but it shows that you lack comprehension skills. Do you need me to point out those errors again?
3) Are you serious for linking me to the pathguy.com? Did you check out his picture? At least he could have worn a suit or something to make him “seem” official. His website seems even worse than quackwatch.com (not an easy
task).
4) From your answer above it seems that you most likely did get a thimerosal containing flu vaccination for your son (or are contemplating it). This proves to me that we (anti-thimerosal freaks) have much more work to do.
5) Ok, I decided to read the WHO report that you referenced. I found this:
“Immune-mediated reactions to products containing mercury (mainly contact allergy as a manifestation of delayed-type hypersensitivity) can occur in some humans”.
– Yes, it can WHO. Good job.
I also found this:
“Experience shows that eliminating or reducing thiomersal from an existing product can have some unexpected effects on vaccine quality, safety and efficacy”.
— Wow, what a shame. To remove a known neurotoxin from vaccines would force pharm companies to actually go back and rethink their quality, safety and efficacy. I heard that the bottle of Tylenol that I have here at home contains high levels of arsenic in it. I’m really not sure if I should continue using it. What a tough decision (NOT)!
6) As I have previously stated, I will not be debating the current pediatric vaccine schedule with you. I will say this, however. You must also take into consideration the “need” for certain vaccines and the recommended schedule. Ok, maybe they are “safer” than they once were (thanks to parents groups whose children have suffered). You also need to show me why it is important for my child to receive the Hep B vaccine at birth. Is this necessary? I don’t think so. We need to address questions like these as well.
-Sue
_1) You should be kissing Barbara Loe Fischer’s butt instead of calling her a baby killer._
No, she is still a baby killer. I will not be kissing her butt for putting my son in danger. I think she needs to look at what havoc she has caused. Pertussis is a deadly disease, and to compaign against an effective vaccine even AFTER an improved on has been put on the market, and STILL after a safe version without the “dreaded” thimerosal has been removed is criminal. Just like all the folks who got behind this guy: http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko.htm
_2) I pointed out 4 errors that you made. Ok, 3 of the 4 are silly little things but it shows that you lack comprehension skills. Do you need me to point out those errors again?_
Do try… because I have not found them nor their references. Neither Geier had anything to do with the change from DTP to DTaP.
_3) Are you serious for linking me to the pathguy.com? Did you check out his picture? At least he could have worn a suit or something to make him “seem†official. His website seems even worse than quackwatch.com (not an easy
task)._
Which picture of him? The only pictures on that particular page is one of a painting and a little animation. If you explored his website and found his photo, based an opinion of his qualifications on that, you seem to be very shallow.
_4) From your answer above it seems that you most likely did get a thimerosal containing flu vaccination for your son (or are contemplating it). This proves to me that we (anti-thimerosal freaks) have much more work to do._
Why would I risk my son’s death from influenza based on your irrational fear of a micro-quantity of thimerosal? Do you have a clue what hypertrophic cardiomyopathy is (it is one of the main causes of sudden cardiac death in adolescents, http://www.4hcm.org/WCMS/index.php?overview )? I also know of a young man who has asthma who also got the flu vaccine. His mom told me that just the week before he had a horrible asthma attack, a very scary one — this is not a kid who would do will with influenza.
Do you understand the concept of relative risk? It is obvious you don’t because you will not answer the very simple question of which vaccine is more dangerous than the actual disease. Now I know that my only error is to try to get you to understand the relatives risks, or even to attempt to penetrate the absolute barrier you’ve locked your closed mind with. But, truthfully, I know you are not the only person reading this comment, and I am sure that there are those with more open minds out there.
Also, I am pretty positive this subject is exhausted and that Kevin should close down the comments.
Thanks, Kevin, for letting go on and on… Sorry for all the link heavy posts.
Wow!
I just found this blog. Kev, I must admit, it’s kind of weird see all these poeple talking about my son and it’s also weird to have you so super-secret about your daughter but perfectly willing to make a post on the web about my son. At the same time, I accept that I have allowed him to be in the public eye. Indeed, “The higher up a tree a monkey climbs, the more of his ass you will see.” (Yes, weirdos, knock yourselves out with that.)
Some comments:
1. I have never said my son is recovered, and he is not.
2. My son is recovering, and making great progress.
3. The reporter who met my son met him in June. Then, she broke her back and the story finally ran in October. So, her observations are 5 months old, which represents about 40% of the time we’ve been treating Jamie. (As an aside, Ms. Valdez was the least thorough, least prepared, least inquisitive, and most skeptical reporter we’ve ever met, and we’ve met a lot. I was not remotely surprised to see so many of you wonderful folks commenting on the story.)
4. The shreiking she refers to, which he did do, he no longer does. It stopped within 24 hours of putting Jamie on the SCD diet.
5. If you are worried that I will stop being a loving parent if Jamie does not recover, well, shit, I made a vow I would be polite on Kev’s blog after reading about Megan and DPT, and I will. Suffice to say I think there is no greater love than the love from parent to child, and I think you would ALL agree.
Jamison was diagnosed in July 2004. Started GF/CF in September, and TD-DMPS in October 2004.
Jamie just turned three in late August. When he was diagnosed, just before his second birthday, he:
– Made zero eye contact
– When playing, if approached, would turn away from us
– Never noticed other children, even his older brother
– Never noticed his parents
– Was emaciated
– Was pale
– Ate a lot of dirt
– Ran along the wall, back and forth, like a rat. For hours.
– Spun around in circles. For hours.
– Did not speak.
– Never, ever smiled
– Never initiated any affection
– Woke up 7-8 times per night
– Had permanent constipation or diarreah
– Was always laying over chairs in obvious pain
– Would shake his hands above his eyes and screech at an ear-piercing level, ALL THE TIME
– Played with trains, his only toys.
So, that was my son. I read stuff by people in the ND crowd back then, and I had a really hard time seeing how this child was going to graduate from college.
Then, I read all the things that many of you think is BS. And, more importantly, I talked to hundreds of parents, and we started treating Jamie. For the first 12 months, WE DID NO BEHAVIORAL THERAPY, just medical interventions. Today (and I will contrast old with new), Jamie:
– Makes eye contact thousands of times a day (Made zero eye contact)
– Grabs us and makes us play with him and is very interactive (When playing, if approached, would turn away from us)
– Notices, and makes eye contact with everyone in the room and plays puzzles with his brother. (Never noticed other children, even his older brother)
– Cries if we leave the room, and runs to hug us when we return from being gone. (Never noticed his parents)
– Is plump (Was emaciated)
– Has rosy cheeks (Was pale)
– No more PICA (Ate a lot of dirt)
– Doesn’t do this at all (Ran along the wall, back and forth, like a rat. For hours.)
– Doesn’t do this at all (Spun around in circles. For hours.)
– Has 75-100 words, including many to get needs met, like open, eat, up, blankie, juice. (Did not speak.)
– Smiles a million times a day and waves hello (Never, ever smiled)
– Hugs us all the time (Never initiated any affection)
– Sleeps through the night (Woke up 7-8 times per night)
– Has 1-2 formed stools every day (Had permanent constipation or diarreah)
– Does not do this (Was always laying over chairs in obvious pain)
– Does not do this (Would shake his hands above his eyes and screech at an ear-piercing level, ALL THE TIME)
– Plays with dozens of different toys, appropriately. (Played with trains, his only toys.)
So, that’s my guy today, October 31st. I just put him to bed, after I finally wrestled his Robin costume off of him. He gave me a big hug, said “night, night”, and went to sleep. If you did no intervention, and your child made the same progress between 2 and 3, then we should both feel very blessed.
JB Handley
If you got my email JB you know exactly why we keep Megan out of public discussions but you’re right – I should apply that criteria to all our kids so I apologise.
That said: You have used the word ‘recovering’ to apply to your son and you allowed Rashid Buttar to describe him as ‘recovered’. You also made the statement about hundreds of recovered kids within a year in an Amazon review of EoH I believe.
I really did find the reporters description quite shocking. It was very odd to hear someone who sounded very similar to my girl being described in those terms. Now, I read your retort on the newspaper site so I know you have issues with the journalism but even so – you have to understand why this is an eyebrow raising article for me.
Oh and Kev C – we agreed to be more civil to each other. I didn’t agree to lift your posting ban. Thats still waiting on your sincere apology.
JB, your story doesn’t really sound all that different from allot of other kids. Do you think your child is the first to improve when problem foods are removed form his/her diet? Do you walk down the center of an 8 lane highway and think you discovered it? So now you are trying the SCD diet and you report further recovery, great! Really that’s great. I wish you all the luck in the world and I sincerely hope that your son continues to improve. Tell me one thing though, why would diet help with mercury poisoning? I guess every person afflicted with gluten enteropathy or milk allergy is also mercury poisoned? Did you know that celiac disease is more common in people with Down Syndrome? If they feel better when avoiding wheat does that mean Down Syndrome is really mercury poisoning? It seems like any alternative medicine that you apply to your child helps with his mercury problems so what else have you used with great success? Still buying the RNA drops?
I understand that you have no use for scientists, main stream doctors, and researchers but won’t that make it difficult to prove your mercury hypothesis. Aren’t some of the studies you hold up as evidence of autism being mercury poisoning authored by scientist types? Some of them are actual scientists and doctors. I guess they’re OK if they support your hypothesis. You know what else I find strange? Why are so many DAN doctors working outside of their chosen disciplines? Where are all of the Ivy League educated DAN doctors or the ones that graduated anywhere near the top of their class?
Folks:
As I have said before, I’m remaining polite, because, after reading the details about Megan/DPT/etc, I was shocked into the realization that we are all fighting the same battle here. So, clone3g, you don’t actually seem interested in my opinion but rather an argument, and I will just say this: we put the Generation Rescue website together to answer the questions you ask, and it is all there for you to read. If you think it’s all quackery, by no means should you feel compelled to pursue any of it. I would caution against using my son as the single barometer of success, which is why we now have more than 300 parents on our site, and dozens of success stories posted (of which my son is not yet one, by the way).
In the previous blog (Mercury Militia – another great term from Kev!!) I raised what I feel are legitimate questions about the circular logic some of you use to avoid even engaging in the topic of whether or not you have been able to prove to yourself that your child in indeed NOT mercury poisoned. I have yet to see even an attempted response to that question. I will be happy to share the results of the tests we have done on my son that prove my point. Of course, you should feel no obligation to do the same, but you must admit it makes it difficult to support your POV, no?
And so it goes. One thing I think we have all learned is that the 2 sides in this thing are very entrenched in their view, myself fully included. I believe we started out open when my son was diagnosed, read everything in the known universe and talked to dozens of doctors from every position, and came to a thoughtful conclusion that my wife and I then documented in detail for you to see at: http://www.generationrescue.org
I’m no scientist, just a dad.
If you are 100% satisfied that your autistic child is not suffering from heavy metal toxicity, than you have a right to be convinced our position is wrong, and shouldn’t even waste your time with us. Heck, we are a “fringe” group with a position that no one in the mainstream world has yet to concede has any real substance. Are we really so threatening? JBInc? Come on folks, we’re 300 parents.
At the same time, we welcome an open, informed debate on the science, and we have begun that process with Mr. Leitch. We look forward to a long, constructive, thoughtful debate, and we are willing to provide more detail to defend our position for the world to see.
I agree with the comment made many times: only science will settle this debate. While I’m disappointed our government (for which my father worked for 30 years) won’t fund a nickle of this important work, I know parents are mobilizing to get the important work started, as the below report spells out.
Please don’t view my lack of future posts as a sign of anything but time prioritization on my part. I chose to post here to give you perspective on the progress of my son, and you should process that information however you see fit.
Very best,
JB
Autism therapies subject of Arizona clinical trials
Clinical trials being carried out in Arizona will look at the effectiveness of two autism therapies, including one that has been met with skepticism by some doctors.
A clinical trial already under way is testing the effects of potent vitamin and mineral supplements on autism symptoms. Children with autism suffer from social withdrawal and the inability to interact and communicate with others.
A second trial beginning in about two weeks will test what’s known as chelation therapy, in which a drug is used to extract heavy metals from the bodies of autistic children. Mercury has emerged as a prime suspect in the increasing numbers of autistic children in the United States.
Dr. Sanford Newmark, a Tucson pediatrician, is the lead physician on both the chelation and vitamin trials. He is conducting physical and nutritional examinations of all the children involved, totaling more than 150 from Tucson and Phoenix, and will monitor their physical health during the trials.
About half the autistic children will receive the active chelation drug or vitamins and a control group will receive a placebo.
Neither the families nor the researchers will know who is receiving which until the trials are concluded by early next year.
Seventy-eight autistic children, ages 3 to 9, are being recruited to test a vitamin-mineral supplement given in powder form three times daily during the four-month trial.
Jim Adams, professor of chemistry at Arizona State University, who is supervising both trials, said previous small studies have shown autistic children have lower blood levels of crucial nutrients than non-autistic children.
Some 80 children will be enrolled in the chelation trial. All will be given initial doses of the chelating agent known as DMSA, dimercaptosuccinic acid, which causes excretion of heavy metals in the urine.
Chelation therapy has been used on many autistic children in the country, but without any scientific proof that it works, and despite the skepticism and disapproval of many physicians.
“I have been very reluctant to recommend chelation,” said Newmark, who specializes in integrative medicine, combining mainstream with alternative treatments.
“Right now, there is absolutely no scientific evidence it affects autism, so I don’t have confidence in it. But that’s why we want to do these trials, to see if we can offer parents some real answers.”
The vitamin study is funded by the Phoenix chapter of the Autism Society of America, ASU and the Autism Research Institute.
The chelation study is funded by the Scottsdale-based Wallace Foundation.
Clone-
Not to stir you up but I personally (not speaking for JB) do think that MANY people who have gluten enteropathy are mercury poisoned. In fact, my daughter was diagnosed with Celiac disease (autoimmune disease) just 30 days after receiving her flu vaccination in 2001. She was only 21 months old. To, me this is not a coincidence. Why do you think so many more people are being diagnosed with Celiac disease? Is it only better diagnosis? Maybe or maybe not.
My daughter also has type 1 diabetes (diagnosed at 11 months of age). No doubt in my mind that this was triggered by her thimerosal-containing vaccinations. Interestingly, from all accounts, the rates of type 1 diabetes have increased a lot over the past 20 years or so. I wonder why? Could it be better diagnosis? Oops, no it can’t. If a person is not diagnosed with type 1 diabetes in a timely manner, they die. So, unlike autism, where the numbers can be messed with easily, type 1 diabetes would be an interesting thing to analyze.
Who knew that you had to graduate from an Ivy League school to know that 1 + 1 = 2? Most DAN doctors have learned that thimerosal + human beings = nightmare.
-Sue
JB –
I am thrilled to see that your son is progressing so well. Unlike others here, I believe every single word that you say about his progress. After seeing what I have seen in my own son, it just seems so obvious…
-Sue
Great Sue. So we can add diabetes and celiac to the list. Are there any diseases that aren’t caused by mercury? Man, if we could just get rid of all of the mercury on the planet we wouldn’t even die! How cool would that be? Just so I can better understand this, one question for you: HOW? I mean you all have some pretty wild explanations for how mercury causes autism so please explain how mercury causes celiac and diabetes, you know, something more than, IT JUST DOES!! It’s the 2nd most toxic substance….
The GR Game Book: IT’S THE MERCURY STUPID
Clone –
1 + 1 = 2 …
-Sue
ε[λy y+4=5] = ε[λy y+22=5] ≡ ∀x([λy y+4=5]x ≡ [λy y+22=5]x)
C16H14N2O
ahhh, all better now
Posted by Jaquelyn McCandless, M.D. on Thursday, October 20 2005
Treating Autism
As a physician specializing in autism, (with a long waiting list as most DAN! doctors) I can testify that these children who have regressive autism are medically ill. If one has a high functioning ASD child who has language and who has not been significantly injured, I could understand “just loving them the way they are.” However, if as most of the children I treat, the gastrointestinal system is inflamed, leading to constant diarrhea or constipation, chronic infestation with yeasts and other parasites, making no eye contact, living in their own world, unable to have any interest in relating or playing with other children, in my opinion it is incredible to imagine anyone thinking they should not be treated as any child who has medical problems. Foods that most people can eat make them more susceptible to inflammation and malnutrition. Healing the gut, providing nutrients that allow them to regain their health, and removal of toxic (to them) food from their diets and toxic metals from their bodies creates healthier bodies in these children, and this helps them learn more easily from the educational opportunities they need. These children are recovering more of their normal function daily. Please go to the next DAN! conference in Long Beach and you will see a number of recovered kids on the stage being interviewed by Lou Diamond-Phillips. Last year with 1200 parents watching there was not a dry eye in the house. These children have a disorder that is preventable (take the toxins out of vaccines), treatable, and more and more every day are recoverable. Well respected scientists such as Dr. Richard Deth, Dr. Jill James, and Dr. Boyd Haley are helping us come to understand this disorder and are leading us to new treatments, many of which have become available long after secretin, which did help us see the involvement of the GI tract in this disease, and long after Dr. Laidler turned against bio-medical treatment. I am very sad to hear that he who helped us write the first chelation protocol still has a severely impaired child and has not been willing to avail himself of all the new treatments that are helping so many kids now have a life. Jaquelyn McCandless, M.D.
Oh, well, if a sex therapist says so….
Better to follow the advice of a former sex therapist (if that’s what you really want to call her) who can add 1 + 1 than follow the advice of a Thimerosal-loving quack…
– Sue
Which one is McCandless?
_”However, if as most of the children I treat, the gastrointestinal system is inflamed, leading to constant diarrhea or constipation, chronic infestation with yeasts and other parasites, making no eye contact, living in their own world, unable to have any interest in relating or playing with other children, in my opinion it is incredible to imagine anyone thinking they should not be treated as any child who has medical problems”_
I quite agree – whats this got to do _with autism_?
_”who can add 1 + 1″_
Adding up is easy. Getting the right answer seems to be problematic for a few people. Mathematics is a science Sue. So far, you have no credible science on your side.
I see why Clone doesn’t get it… his reading comprehension skills stink!
-Sue
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/history/2002/2002awards.htm
The other book written by McCandless:
Oh… the other link above shows an award she received a few years back.
MORE on McCandless!
From http://www.fumento.com/hatemail/hatemail25.html there is this assessment of her (the whole page is a fun read): “Let’s see, you’re a quack doctor who publishes books like “Children with Starving Brains” that viciously prey on ignorant parents and who writes papers such as “A Bio-Medical Treatment Approach to Autism Spectrum Disorder, Including Heavy Metal Detoxification.” Are you aware that one Rebecca Lee Roczen, M.D. had her license suspended for five years for doing apparently exactly what you’re doing? When is your hearing? “
Ah, I see. She’s the thimerosal-loving quack!
HN-
You have just shown that you are way over your head. Even your friends here probably won’t back you up on your Fumento reference. I thought that EVERYONE knew that Fumento gets paid by Eli Lilly to write what he does. That’s common knowledge. He also gets paid to say that second-hand smoke doesn’t cause cancer, etc. Trust me, you don’t want to align yourself with him.
As for McCandless, who knew you were such a prude, HN? Loosen up a little…
-Sue
Snort… LOL… So even without substantial proof you claim the Fumento is not trustworthy because he gets money from a pharmaceutical. I actually do not care for the Hudson Institute, Washington Times or lawyers (all of which Fumento is ACTUALLY associated with), but I usually have information to agree with him in this count (and some others, but not all). See http://www.fumento.com/biography.html
Not surprising, considering you dismissed an opinion based on how the author LOOKED!
Anyway it is not about being a “prude”… It is about the sudden change of specialties. Changing to one which lets her cash in on frightened parents. Writing a book does not necesarily make her an “expert”… see:
Click to access ShortPeerReviewGuide.pdf
A question for those of you with kids under the age of 4: Exactly how much mercury did your kids get? Just give me the total in grams. Thanks.
To help you calculate I think you should use these two sites:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=microgram
and
http://www.fda.gov/cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm
No, HN, writing a book does not automatically make her an expert. I don’t know what you do or don’t know about Dr. McCandless but for the sake of discussion, I will assume that you are ignorant to her beginnings.
Dr. McCandless began her involvement in treating ASD children when her own granddaughter was diagnosed with severe autism in 1996. She did research and realized that most physicians were clueless as to the GI and immune system problems in ASD children. Instead, it seemed that most doctors thought of autism as a genetic disorder and offered only behavioral therapies. She has since treated thousands of children over the past few years with much success. I find it fascinating that you would seem to question her motives. You wrote:
” It is about the sudden change of specialties. Changing to one which lets her cash in on frightened parents”.
– Interesting view. She made a career change because of a desire to help children (including her own granddaughter). She has also treated thousands of children successfully with ASD. What a bitch… The nerve…
So, as far as I’m concerned she is an expert. I would be interested in what your “experts” have to say about the immune system dysfunction and GI problems of many ASD children?
-Sue
Sue,
I’m not sure who HN’s “experts” are but I can assure you that very few people consider McCandless to be an expert at anything. Perhaps couple’s therapy but that’s probably more of an art than science. I’m sure she is a very sweet grandmother and I bet she makes a mean batch of macadamia nut cookies but her grasp of immunology and the biology of autism is poor and secondhand at best. She’s collected some strange ideas along her autism scavenger hunt and she’s been brave enough to put them in print without fully understanding most of them. I guess that’s why Binstock had to help her with the Sciency stuff. You don’t need an Ivy League degree to know that 1+1=2 and you don’t need a medical degree to know the difference between “infestation” and “infection.” No high school biology student would ever make that mistake. (That’s only one example, more upon request)
Where all of these thousands of children she’s treated successfully and by successfully do you mean recovered or just better over time? Or do you mean her financial success? Is her granddaughter still autistic?
Well, I have to get back to my tantric chelation now.
Clone-
I can’t wait to hear what HN’s experts have to say… it should be fun if Fumento and Pathguy are examples of what she/he has come up with previously.
Where are YOUR experts and what do they say? Do you agree that some children diagnosed with an ASD have GI and immune system dysfunction? If not, then we agree to disagree and there is simply no point for you and I to discuss it any further. If you agree with that basic principal than I want to know what your experts have to say. Where the h*ll are they? Seriously Clone, where are they? We need them. If you don’t like McCandless than show me someone else who is out there with ideas. This group is quick to criticize our “experts” but don’t seem too keen on showing us what yours have to say … specifically on the medical side of things… I suppose anyone can suggest OT therapy… that takes a Harvard degree (Not!). Come on, show me…
I am on several groups that have thousands of parents whose children are doing significantly better using biomed treatment (including my son)… Why are you so threatened by this fact. It baffles me.
-Sue
I’m not threatened in the least. I just have this thing for truth. Sue, there are plenty of legitimate scientists, and yes experts, looking at all aspects of autism including immune and gastrointestinal features. I’m sure McCandless and Binstock are busy investigating the same things in the lobby of some hotel or a lab in the back of a van but the real scientists don’t work that way. Where are they? Check Medline and plug in the search terms Autism AND immune and see what you find. McCandless may even show up, who knows…..
I don’t have any experts. I don’t own any people and I am not at trial so no need for experts, thanks.
Clone –
That’s right you don’t have any experts. It’s obvious. No, you’re not at trial but the CDC, FDA, and pharm companies who screwed up with the Thimerosal fiasco will be soon. You can sit around and wait for all your credentialed “experts” to do their studies, etc. I already have the answer… You’ll get there someday.
I’m done with this… Takes up too much time. Unless HN has something to say about my above post, or if Kev is interested in sharing what convinced him to change his tune from Aug. 2004 to Feb/March 2005 — then I will leave you all to discuss, well, nothing….
-Sue
Well the court’s in your ball. Bye Sue ’em 😉
_”No, you’re not at trial but the CDC, FDA, and pharm companies who screwed up with the Thimerosal fiasco will be soon. You can sit around and wait for all your credentialed “experts†to do their studies, etc. I already have the answer…”_
Except they already are Sue. And guess what? Your time is running out. Here’s the situation: The Omnibus case against vaccines has until Jan 2006 to announce who its experts will be. It has until (I think) Sept 2006 to formulate its position. There are apparently 5 studies that are being done now that are nedded for the Omnibus position.
Congress has already substantially delayed these proceedings – to the detriment of individual families. I would think the likes of Kirby, Buttar et al are hoping and praying that something – anything – comes out of just one of these studies. And that they are better science than the Geiers ever managed.
If they’re not, your case will be dead.
Thanks for the interesting read, Kev. I think that you know that this “case” will not be dead until the truth comes out… Not the truth based on CDC lies, but the “real” truth.
It looks like the movie based on “Evidence of Harm” will begin production some time next year. Minimally, the court of public opinion will get the facts… that should be fun.
-Sue
Sue, if you really truly believe that a debate about science is best conducted by Hollywood then that tells me all I need to know about the state of the science behind your argument.
When did American culture get so screwed up that it became more important to listen to Tom Cruise than Stephen Hawking?
Kev-
I don’t see where I said that the debate about science is best conducted by Hollywood. I don’t believe that it is. I will say, however, that it may be the spark that is needed for the masses to understand what has gone on here. We have been told a pile of crap from medical officials for years and it is time to set the record straight. If the only way to do it is through a movie — I’m all for it.
As for Stephen Hawking, I admit to being ignorant to his beliefs. What exactly are Mr. Hawking’s thoughts of thimerosal in vaccines. I did a quick Google search and found basically NOTHING of substance. It’s possible that I just missed it…
-Sue
_”don’t see where I said that the debate about science is best conducted by Hollywood. I don’t believe that it is. ….. If the only way to do it is through a movie—I’m all for it.”_
Your words Sue. That contradict each other.
What your esentially admitting here is that you have no valid scientific basis for your claim, that your legal position is untenable and that the only way you can make a point is through a work of fiction. No surprise to the rest of us obviously but surprising to hear you admit it.
_”As for Stephen Hawking, I admit to being ignorant to his beliefs. What exactly are Mr. Hawking’s thoughts of thimerosal in vaccines. I did a quick Google search and found basically NOTHING of substance. It’s possible that I just missed it…”_
Er, neither has Tom Cruise (funny how you only question the word of the scientist though). Anyway, your task for today is to assimilate all meanings of the phrase rhetorical device.
Kev –
The movie would be based upon the book Evidence of Harm, hardly a work of fiction 🙂 . Don’t worry though, I believe that we will win in the court system also… I actually enjoyed reading the Omnibus case against vaccines that you referenced. It seems the Special Master is “getting it” too. He wrote:
“I conclude that in each case I have DISCRETION to allow the petitioner to keep the petition pending as long as it seems appropriate under all the circumstances of the case”.
Rough translation: Cut the crap, respondent . I’m the boss here and your not looking too good.
You wrote:
“Er, neither has Tom Cruise (funny how you only question the word of the scientist though)”.
– Where am I questioning the word of the scientist? Please advise. I would be very interested in hearing what Mr. Hawking had to say about thimerosal in vaccines…
Again Kev, I am looking to see where you went so terribly wrong. Last August you believed that your daughter’s Autism was triggered by her vaccines and you were convinced that thimerosal needed to be fully investigated. What changed since then? Do tell.
– Sue
No the movie would be:
http://skeptico.blogs.com/skeptico/2005/07/vaccines__its_t.html
On Kirby’s book:
http://www.spiked-online.com/Articles/0000000CAB30.htm
An addendum:
What amount of thimerosal has a child in the USA received if they were born after 2001? Use http://www.fda.gov/cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm for a reference.
Why would 25 MICROgrams of thimerosal in an influenza vaccine effect a 200+ pound teenager more than getting the disease… especially since his very severe genetic heart condition requires that he get prophylatic antibiotics before his teeth are cleaned at the dentist?
SURPRISE! The kids grow up… they gain weight. Some of them even get taller than their parents! (I am now the shortest member of my family. That is one of the effects of marrying someone 11 inches talle!) This child who has had more than ten years of speech therapy is now an 11th grader in high school who is much taller than me and is very very big! (oh, and stubborn… think about that with your own kid!)
I am still wondering what vaccine is more dangerous than the actual disease.
Should you want to understand why some of us worry about flu just check out (I remember there was a time when I was about 9 years old when I got sick… I only remember waking up after two weeks, my brother just tells me my parents were very worried… that was in 1967, a year BEFORE a flu pandemic):
http://www.familiesfightingflu.com/
(Oh, sorry Kevin… I’m broaching your URL limit!)…
and:
http://pkids.org/index2.htm